In this episode I clear up the misinformation about a widespread myth in the mold world - the claim that mycotoxins are volatile organic compounds (VOCs). Spoiler alert — they’re not.
Learn the science behind mycotoxins, how they differ from VOCs, and why this misunderstanding can lead to misdiagnosis, ineffective testing, and wasted money. Whether you're a homeowner, practitioner or mold inspector, this episode will give you the clarity to separate fact from fiction — and protect your health and your wallet.
The Mold Money Podcast
TRANSCRIPT
Today's episode is on Why Mycotoxins Are Not VOCs. One of the things I hear doctors and people say a lot is, and it's because I think, I think they think it's mycotoxins must be in the air, and that's how they get sick, they breathe them.
And because they're in the air, they must be gases. Basically, a VOC is a volatile organic compound. What they mean is it's a vapor that you breathe a mycotoxin, and that simply is not true.
They're not gases, they're solids. And I've been wondering how do people come to that conclusion, that statement, and I think I've discovered maybe how it came to be, how people think.
This all came about because one of listeners sent me an email and said, I heard on your podcast that all molds can produce mycotoxins. I've never heard this before. Is there research showing this?
So I'm going to read my response real quick. I love the way people ask the questions. How would you show research showing everything can do this?
Can you research that everything produces something? Tell me the molds you think are non-toxic. Let's start that way.
Let's show me the research that shows this mold cannot produce a mycotoxin, which is a long discussion for the next one. So in terms of VOCs, the two references here that are really clearly saying it's not a volatile gas mycotoxins.
The first one is the classic, we call it the red book in my industry, Bio Aerosols Assessment and Control by ACGIH. The American Conference of Governmental Industrial Hygienist Published Hardcover, 1999.
I've got a stack of books here, 10 or 15 books, on average, $100 a piece. Some of them may be $200, $300 books.
The difficulty with discovering what's true and not true these days is with AI, which is where most people go to search, myself included, except for today's episode and tomorrow's on mycotoxins and VOCs. How do you know what's really true?
AI is going to give you the popular, statistically popular answer. And where's the reference? And having stuff in print is very valuable.
An editor has verified the source. From Bio Aerocells Assessment and Control on mycotoxins. So this is section chapter 24, fungal toxins.
The key word is toxins. Quite simply: myco, mold, toxin, toxin. In general, fall into two classes.
A, secondary products of metabolism, mycotoxins, antibiotics, and VOCs. This is where I think people took it out of context. And B, structural components.
These are gluons in the cell walls. I'm quoting, mycotoxins are non-volatile, relatively low molecular weight, secondary metabolic products. That may affect exposed persons in a variety of ways.
So you have literally, mycotoxins, non-volatile. Here's where I think people think they're gases. So this has been used in the same sentence as VOCs.
VOCs, when it comes to mold, there's a little M or a big M, MVOC. That doesn't mean mycotoxin VOC. That means microbial VOC.
Doesn't even mean mold VOC either. It means microbial. What's microbial VOC?
From a microbe, a bacteria. Bacteria and molds are two of the most generally commonly in our industry. When I say our industry, I mean certified microbial consultants, which is my certification.
Basically a high level of mold inspector, bacteria, bacteria mold, anything microbe. MVOC means microbial VOC.
So I'm wondering if people that did some kind of research, maybe textbook before AI, AI is not that many years old, or internet, internet probably, and saw the word MVOC in the same paragraph with mycotoxins and VOCs, these three words and didn't know any better because they're just searching for stuff and they're not trained and educated and I'm not being condescending here. I think it's brilliant or fascinating. So you see the word MVOC and think that maybe means mycotoxin VOC, not true.
So that's the first text. The second one is something you probably can't find online. I have a hard copy because we're allowed to get whatever kind of continued education we want.
Years ago, 15, 20 years, even though I've had a microscope since I was 12, I had a lab when we were kids growing up and I was the biologist. I used to grow mold and study under the microscope. I'm not making this up.
I was told we can't call ourselves geeks. Five years ago, it was politically incorrect and now I guess it's, I was like, what? I can call myself a geek.
Now it's okay again. This is a spiral bound publication. And I got it when I took a week long course at the McCrone Research Institute in Chicago to learn how to identify molds under the microscope.
The title of this publication is Introduction to Mycology, Mold in Buildings. And it's by John Haynes. He is a true mycologist.
October 27th, 2002. This is again is the great thing about printed documents from the American College of Occupational and Environmental Medicine, Adverse Human Health Effects Associated with Molds in the Indoor Environment.
It talks about all the way that molds can make us sick. And particularly going to the section titled Toxicity. It starts off with, mycotoxins are secondary metabolites of fungi.
People love to say that like, oh, they're secondary metabolites, as if they know what they're talking about. And then they say they're VOCs. Not required for growth, of course.
The amount, if any, and type of mycotoxin produced is dependent on a complex and poorly understood interaction of factors that probably include nutrition, growth, substrate, that's what it's growing on, moisture, temperature, etc., etc.
Because basically we don't know. When produced, mycotoxins are found in all parts of the fungal ecology, including the hyphae, mycelia spores, and substrate that it's growing on, either drywall or the wood. This is what I keep telling people.
You don't need to breathe it as a gas to get exposed. It's in everything, the spores, the mycelium. It's not just even on the spores, because mold doesn't have a stomach.
It's spitting out these enzymes, these metabolites. It's all over the stuff, the drywall, the wood, the carpet. When you breathe those particles, that's when you could breathe and even ingest.
And you say, how can I ingest mold? Just because it's in the building. I remember going to courses on PPE, personal protective equipment.
Ironically, one of the biggest exposures to workers in the mold remediation business, and they don't realize this, is not through the air. They're wearing these respirators. It's ingestion.
I'm like, how's that possible? Well, they're handling moldy materials all day long. Probably not wearing their gloves.
In one way or another, like a kid, like children, I was fascinated by this too. How is with lead paint for kids, ingestion, the path of exposure? Well, they lick their fingers.
Anywho, to quote from this document, mycotoxins are relatively large molecules that are not significantly volatile. They do not evaporate or off gas into the environment, nor do they migrate through walls or floors independent of a particle.
Meaning, they are attached to particles. Thus, an inhalation exposure to mycotoxins requires generation of an aerosol of substrate, that again is what it's grown on the drywall of the wood, an aerosol of substrate, fungal fragments, or spores.
Oh, and in terms of worker exposure, the skin. So back to the document. Spores and fungal fragments do not pass through the skin, but cause irritation if there's a contact with large amounts of contaminated material in contact with the skin.
Now, in contrast, back to the microbial VOCs. See, this is in the same statement. This is where I think people took microtoxins being VOCs out of context, thought that an MVLC was a mycotoxin VOC.
Quoting again, in contrast, microbial VOCs are low molecular weight, alcohols, aldehydes and ketones, having very low odor thresholds, meaning you can't smell them unless you have a good nose or it gets really bad.
MVOCs are responsible for the musty, disagreeable odor associated with mold and mildew. And maybe you're responsible for the objectionable taste of spoiled foods. So, see, these MVOCs are the odors.
That's what you smell. That's the stinkiness of mold. And it's not always the same, and it's not literally the mold.
It's like a human being having gas, flatulence. It's what I ate. It's what the mold ate.
That's why they call them secondary metabolites. And it's a similar thing with the microtoxins, except they're not gases. They're solids.
So there you have it. Two sources that clearly explain mycotoxins are not gases. They're not VOCs.
Do not confuse an MVOC, microbial VOCs, volatile organic compound, with a microtoxin. On the next show, I'm going to dive into my explanation of why I said, made the statement, all molds are capable of producing a mycotoxin.